In issues surrounding the death process, Dannion is one of the premiere crusaders on behalf of hospice and palliative care, and is a leading expert in the field of grief and bereavement. Dannion is also a driving force in the integration of complimentary and allopathic medicine, especially in end-of-life. He has co-created a non-profit organization, The Twilight Brigade (Compassion In Action), to recruit and train volunteers to be at the bedside of those in transition.
Dannion has appeared on national television and radio shows, including Larry King, Oprah, Dateline, Unsolved Mysteries, Art Bell, George Noory's Coast to Coast AM, The BBC, PAX Network, and many others. A made for television movie based on Dannion's best seller, Saved by the Light, debuted as one of the highest rated television movies in FOX Television network history. He is also the author of At Peace in the Light and The Secrets of the light, and is presently writing his new book, "Ten Things To Know Before You Go."
Keystone Pipeline System (Western Canada)
Date: 2012-02-06, 5:16PM PST
Why is the oil of Canada being sent to the US for processing? An oil refinery built by Canadians, operated by Canadians, and selling refined oil to the Pacific Rim ans US would seem to me to be a good thing for Canada's workers.
Selling natural resources seems more like the act of a third world country. Processing the oli and getting a higher value seems like a better option.
Does the Bush-Chaney-Perry Texas oil cartel have a lock on Canada's politicians?
Location: Western Canada
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Please note the differences between the original and me. I have been using full sentences, higher vocabulary, changed location, and DONT type in bold font.
Yes you are correct in that "Any schmuck can scribble an attack post." But I would like to think that a) I didnt attack anybody, and b) I did a well thought out posting... that you did not read....
In fact... when you actually read what you have been flagging it says "Its seems like the people who choose to shout about it are... surprise surprise... kinda dumb."
So yes I do agree with you that whomever started this Hostile feminist rant is not up to par.
But I still think that he has the right to say it.
And I still think that what you are doing is wrong.
Location: the back of the room
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You do NOT make a connection between militant feminism and RCMP hiring practices. You merely assume it.
You also, admittedly, do not cite any instance of how feminists inflict themselves on the RCMP.
If you expect people to take you seriously, provide evidence. Any schmuck can scribble an attack post.
BTW, your sanctimony about freedom of expression is laughable.
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Am I attacking the RCMP by wondering how they are going to implement a gender fair work environment?
Am I attacking the feminist movement for questioning some of the methods they have proposed? ( not that i mention them at any point )
Am i attacking the previous posters? Well i kinda do that in the first sentence but thats not what the body of the text is about.
Is this unsubstantiated for asking in the post for more information about this RCMP announcement?
It almost makes me wonder if you even bothered to read my posting and just assumed im a bad guy for commenting on the gender issue in a neutral fashion.
Now all that being said, maybe its time you read the reasons you are supposed to flag something.
the three reasons are :
miscategorized - wrong category/site, discusses another ad, otherwise misplaced
prohibited - violates craigslist Terms of Use or other posted guidelines
spam/overpost - posted too frequently, in multiple cities/categories, or is too commercial
Now while it might seem like a good idea to flag things that are "irresponsible posts" what the nature of irresponsible posts is, well, is a matter of opinion. Which is probably why it is not a flag-able offense. The right of freedom of expression is the right to express my opinions. As long as I am harming no one then i am free to say as i see fit.
One of the hardest parts of having a free nation is that there are times that others will do or say things that you do not agree with, and if you are to be a true believer in freedom of expression then the only true response is to use your own freedom of speech is return.
The entire reason that we as a nation have these public morals is that it is hoped that by having open and fair communal discussions we can reach a more informed truth.
Location: The back of the room
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Flagging down something that you dont agree with only creates a censorship environment that im sure most of us can agree is not in our collective best interest. IE SOPA PIPPA or the Canadian versions that I hope you are aware of Bill C-11
I hope that this post will get a few more responses, if at least in support of an open environment of discussion and debate.
For continuity sake this was posted three days ago just before the other post from the back of the room.
Date:2012-02-02 18:35:25
PostID:2832014660
Title:(politics) RE: HOSTILE FEMINISTS AND BOB PAULSON -
It always annoys me when this topic is brought up. Its seems like the people who choose to shout about it are... surprise surprise... kinda dumb.
That being said there is an issue here.
In the fight for gender equality there seems to be a lack of discussion about what equality means and how to go about it. Does it mean enforcing equal numbers in various jobs, or does it mean giving everyone a fair chance.
Now first of all i did a quick check for the news story on this and couldn't find it so if someone can poit it for me that would be great. So really im just going by what the first poster said.
Now...
To say that the police force MUST consist of 35% women creates a number of problems and raises a few questions too. Are women not becoming police officers because of a sexist application process, or is it because women are not applying. Do we need to target women in the recruiting campaign? Do we need to more closely watch the reviewers during application tests? Is the application process favoured towards men? Must we set a number?
Not an easy answer problem and im sure with a bit of thought you can raise a few more questions of your own.
In my experience by trying to ENFORCE a minimum number to create equality only serves to placate the loud (see top), lower the standards of entry, and force otherwise very qualified applicants out the door simply because they happen to be the wrong gender.
Ill be interested to see how the police department chooses what path to take towards "equality"
Location: The back of the room
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Location: The Back of the room
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Defamation of character?! How can I defame what does not exist?
File your complaint----PLEASE!
RE:RE:re:ctalk Canada is bigoted
Date: 2012-02-04, 11:46PM PST
This posting is defamation of character and also libellous. I do not publish "defamatory crap". You are neither rational or honest.
I will be filing a human rights complaint against you for violating my rights. You can not hide behind Freedom of expression when it comes to Libel. I find you insulting.
***
(MY POST)
Bullshit.
Ctalk IS bigoted because it publishes defamatory crap from the likes of you and tries to hide behind the skirt of "freedom of expression."
Opinions are NOT racism, contrary to your uninformed "opinion."
All opinions are valid, so long as they are honest, rational and defensible.
That excludes yours and those on ctalkcanada.
Clear enough?
This posting is defamation of character and also libellous. I do not publish "defamatory crap". You are neither rational or honest.
I will be filing a human rights complaint against you for violating my rights. You can not hide behind Freedom of expression when it comes to Libel. I find you insulting.
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That excludes yours and those on ctalkcanada.
Clear enough?
This posting is defamation of character and also libellous. I do not publish "defamatory crap". You are neither rational or honest.
I will be filing a human rights complaint against you for violating my rights. You can not hide behind Freedom of expression when it comes to Libel. I find you insulting.
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That excludes yours and those on ctalkcanada.
Clear enough?
RE:ctalk Canada is bigoted
Date: 2012-02-04, 10:47AM PST
Opinions are now racism. If you don't like Obama you're a racist.
This is the Cran Campbell Mentality.
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Government has an obligation to prove for public wants. The law of the jungle is no law for a civilized society.
You, sir, are an idiot.
Re: Harper & OAS (Canada)
Date: 2012-02-01, 1:39PM PST
So, what civil liberties have you had destroyed?
What exactly is wrong with people taking repsonsibility for the consequences of their own actions or inactions? In other words, quit relying on the government everytime something doesn't work out for you in your life. I think I mentioned entitlement in my first post.
* Location: Canada
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If he must do this then how about returning our premiums with interest. Don't imagine
that he wants to go there. People who are the backbone of this country, not the pencil neck
geeks from the stock market, should be treated with more respect. We build the roads you
drive on, care for your worthless ass when you get sick, teach your kids, keep criminals
from stealing what you have stolen.
Also if we stopped giving money to the oil companies which have made record profits the
past number of years while everyone else has been suffering. Tax the wealthy at a solid
40% or even better go to a flat tax where everyone and I mean everyone pays 15% of
every dollar they make as tax to be shared by all levels of government.
I would like to be treated fairly by the folks I've helped make a lot of money over the years,
I'm not a fucking idiot and I think these guys are running amok.
As far a Free Markets go we have never had anything like it happen anywhere in North America
since the American Revolution. Big business would freak out if they were exposed to real
Competition. The Anti-Combines laws have been flouted shamelessly. One company owning
many competing brands of car lots. How could there not be price fixing there.
The banking system must be changed. It is plain to see that what we've done in the past
simply does not work. Do we need to be hit over the head with a shovel to see this. The
current group of free marketers that Harper is tied to are anything but free marketers.
Absolutely. Fed. government should stay out of a lot of things local governments could do
better.
We should not get involved with anymore American police actions without Officially
declaring war. There could be grounds for terrorist reprisals for what we've already
done. This used to be a Peace Keeping Nation, Not a War Machine.
Oil is going to run out some day. They are'nt going to make anymore unless we come
into a new ice age. Conservation is the best way to save money on this, Let's put our
best brains one this job instead of having them try to suck the last bit of crushed
dinosaur out of the ground. We are woefully behind in doing this. We'll be caught with
our pants down and get our asses well kicked.
Steve Harper is tied to an old way of doing this that is part of the last century. We
cannot go back to it, however nice it might be. We need leaders with a vision of the
future that is necessarily divorced from the past. Fly over B.C. and see how few
big stands of tall trees are left. The damage left by the oil sand extraction will take
decades to remediate. Don't fall for those stupid TV ads about what a great job
they do of cleaning up after themselves. These are the same bumfucks that poisoned
Aquifers in South America and now they're going to do it here. Oil lines that don't
leak. In this maintenance deferred society it is not possible. People love their
Hummers and F350's too much to see the what little is left.
Use it up til it's all gone. Guess that's what will happen. Electric cars will never
be economical. Smaller is better. Use less of everything to preserve a vestige
of yesterday. The Conservatives are a bunch of old cronies that are just stuck
in the past.
Location: Canada's working class
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Re: Harper and OAS (Canada)
Date: 2012-02-01, 10:45AM PST
I am one of the so-called fools that voted for this majority government and they are doing exactly what I elected them to do.
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My qestion to you all is fill the the blanks
1) how many gun related shootings in surrey per year ___ (numbers please, no percentage)
2) how many gun related deaths in surrey per year ______ (numbers only)
3) how many innocent people killed in these shooting per year____--( numbers only)
4) how many of these shooting are gang releated, people known to police, or drug related______
6) how many of shooting are done with registered gun_____
7) how many vehicle accidents caused by drunk drivers per year in surrey___
8) how many drivers are involved in these drunk driving, or how many end up in collisions with their own family members ___
9) how many people die in these drunk drivings per year ____
10) how many of innocent people are killed by drunk drivers _____
11) now which one paints a bigger picture___
12) so which on should have a higher priority___
13) use some common senses,,, not the position you hold,,,,,, or make statement by virtue of you position....
try answering these questions,,,,,
the MEDIA is gutless, and have no sense of asking LOGICAL questions,,, or they dare not question the politicans
Have any one asked the politican, that they are being overpaid ,,, how many hours do they work,,,, why they should be paid benefits,when the rest of the public had to pay from their pockets for going to work,,,,,
This is what my party stand for==== service to public,,,
+++= to be least paid public servants compared to rest of canads
___ general public contributes nothing for benefits,, pension, they can be bought by the politician since they all make over
50K
=== claims you expenses on your tax returns,,, not out of the pockets of the taxpayers
---- audit all work hours , be paid hourly,,, only to attend meeting related to city business which are logical and for the
sole benefit of the public
=== all meeting to be made public and open to public,
---- no golden handshake payouts
----- if you are fired, you quit, you have no course of legal action,,, no benefits to be paid out, no contracts,,, no benefits,
no pay of more than a 100k
thanks
Location: surrey
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I propose a massive insurrection movement if Harper tries to raise the retirement w/full
pension age. There are a lot of us who worked our asses off and wore our bodies out
knowing that we could retire at 65 and have a mimimum amount to live on. This just
shows the lack of humanity in this government. Cut the oil sands subsidies instead.
Why the fuck did they send our soldiers into Afghanistan and Libya and waste millions or
more on no substantive change in those countries, no matter how they paint it. There are
a number federal departments that do basically nothing but create good income for their
toadies. The Appointments Commission being one of these,
We got into the current world financial debacle because our governments allowed banks to
get away with murder. What bank in their right minds would loan money to a country like
Greece, knowing that the had no chance of paying it back. They count on taxpayers in
other countries to bale out their heinous asses. The same shit happened down south with
the zero down mortgages and asset backed securities. The banks got baled out there too,
and the Bush government knew exactly what was going on. Go back in time to Enron and
see the same bullshit has been going on for years. Obama is in this shit too.
Banks are not our Friends. You do the bank a large favor every time you walk in their doors.
A thing called fractional banking allows them to loan out all but a tiny percentage of the money
you deposit in good faith that if you need it, you can come and get it back. A run on the banks
could still occur the same way they did in the 1930's. This is another sort of bullshit these
right wing governments are in bed with. They are literally smiling all the way to that bank
while they flip the bird at the rest of us.
If we do not vote these base miscreants out next chance we get, then we deserve what we get
Please, look into this, follow links and read between the lines. We are being sold a bill of goods.
One thing that has happened is that there a quite a few recent immigrants living on government
income that have never put a penny into the system. The old extended members of the their
families go right onto welfare. I propose a .5 of one percent more income tax to be levied on
immigrants to help pay for services they use that they have no stake in. This would not be
a userious amount, but would still generate a lot of income to beef up things like Canada
Pension and Medical Plan. This is not predudicial, it's just playing fair with the good chance
we are giving them. I would expect to do the same were I an immigrant anywhere else.
Location: All of Canada
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Tod Fletcher: The Truth About 9/11 - THE TWIN TOWERS, WTC7, PENTAGON + (WCT)
Date: 2012-01-28, 8:04PM PST
Ever since the moment of the first impact at the World Trade Center, a struggle has raged between two broad, competing ideas of what really happened on September 11th, 2001.
The US administration delivered an almost immediate verdict, which can be described as follows: Dispatched by Osama Bin Ladin's network and motivated by hatred and religious fanaticism, 19 suicide bombers hijacked four planes, crashed three of them into their targets, and caused the collapse of the Twin Towers as a consequence of the resulting damage and fires. The 19 men did not necessarily require any accomplices within the United States; and no one in the US government could have possibly anticipated or prevented the attacks.
What is all this crap really doing for us. Is life really any better with all the digital crap.
smart phones you can watch TV drivel on or simply work as a servants bell tied to your
job. Did we get into trouble when Joe Average started investing in stocks from his laptop
without a good knowlege of how phony the stock market is?
Do you spend most of your day answering emails, texts, or aimlessly searching thru music
and movies.
What we need is one digital free day a week. We could get some unimpeded work done or
simply relax without any electronic impingment. Sound really good to me.
I have refused to return any and all text messages. I don't want to encourage my carpal
tunnel problem to worsen. You can watch movies on your i-pad. So what, I like a big
screen and sitting there with a bowl of popcorn. This crap costs a lot of money and
really just adds to our stress.
I see a day when the government implants chips in our heads to read our seditous
thoughts. Smart meters are a chance for big brother to get a little closer. They would
not be going to the expense of doing this is there wasn't something in it for them.
Go for a walk in the woods for at least 2 hours each week. Leave all your electronic
tethers at home and you will come back with the computer between your ears working
a lot faster. Try it, you'll like it. Not on skis, snowmobiles. dirt bikes, just shank's mare.
Location: North Vancouver
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I think everyone should refuse to pay there bill to B.C. Hydro until they switch back to the analog meters and these criminals who allowed this to begin with "Gordon Campbell" should be held accountable!! Why do we keep allowing these politicians to run this province?
Gordon Campbell was in bed with the bilderberg group.
The fact of the matter re: the ecomomy is that we have been living beyond our
means for years, using up resourses that rightfully belong to future generations.
We allow banks to use us endlessly and then bail them out when they get in a bit of
trouble. We drive around in F350's and Ram pickup trucks to get groceries or pump
up our failing manhood,
We farmed out our manufacturing and allowed our leaders to lead us into useless
wars, without actually declaring war legally. (this then would constitute an illegal
police action.) The true cost of these actions will never be fully accounted for, but
you can be sure it would be in the trillions.
Sure, it would sure be nice to have the 1950's back again, but with the huge increase
in world population it is only doable for a small group of people, the meglomaniacs.
We can never get back to where we were. We used up most of the resources, never
thinking to conserve them. Now the oceans are dying, the air around cities is a
brown soup, aquifiers that provide fresh water have been depleted or poisoned.
We have allowed populations to get out of control to the point of the inability to
support them all.
We need to take the blinkers off and get our heads out of our asses and do what
we can to save what little is left. Pipelines and oil tankers can support the status
quo for a few more years, but unless we actively seek alternatives we'll be left in
a sorry state in the near future.
Unfortunately there are no political parties in either Canada or the USA that can
do anything to help. They are the pons of lobbyists and power barons. They are
going to run us off a steep cliff. We need a change from the current system. It
should be obvious to everyone by now the capitalism as it has been practiced in
that past 100 years only works for a few years at a time. I repeat, we have
mortgaged the future just to get to the sorry state we are in now.
We need some intelligent people (not Harper, Ginrich, Obama) to lead us out of
this. The power barons have lost their heads and are stuck in a past that cannot
be repeated, no matter how much money they throw at it.
We must back off and study, inventory the remaining supply of agricultural land,
fresh water, trees, minerals, food supply, etc. before we reach the tipping point
that signals the total loss of control. Husband what we have left and all learn to
live with a little less. WE CANNOT BUY OUR WAY OUT OF IT THIS TIME!
Location: Canada and the USA
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Only a propagandist with no sense of self parody would write: "I am being fair, true and equal."
FLAG this idiot and help clean up CL pollution.
Obama the food stamps pig (vancouver)
Date: 2012-01-26, 8:04PM PST
With President Barack Obama not being able to produce jobs, in fact losing 2.5 million jobs, he has turned America into a ghetto. Unlike his predessor who over 8 years caused a 4 trillion dollar debt, opposed to his successor Obama with 3 years and 5 trillion dollars, who is worst. There are 25 million Americans living on food stamps and needing some sort of funding backed by a massively indebt country. When President Barack Obama came into power, his own people just screamed and backed this guy like he was the incoming messiah.
Newt Gingrich respectively labelled him the greatest food stamps president. He is definately the greatest president who has not been able to increase the value in the states. He lost the triple A rating, he lost trillions to a huge growing debt, can't create jobs, his health care is horrendous. This by far is the worst president in Americans history, right under the peanut farmer Jimmy Carter.
But I have to be fair, true, and equal. That slogan is obviously true in my statement that I have already been able to summarize.
I am being fair, true and equal. Which sides I'm I not being unfair or untrue or unequal. Perhaps some left winged nuts and right winged zealots might argue, but it is fair.
C-Talk: Fair, True and Equal.
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Do you think I care if anyone (especially you) hate me? I don't surrender to any one but God. I have the right to bring God into ANY part of
my life that I choose to. Who the hell are you to set boundaries for me. Only God sets my boundaries.
[I did not set any boundaries; I merely pointed out that you don't know to argue.]
This life is just an illusion.
[This proves you're irrational, a necessary quality for a religious believer]
I can easily say you are being delusional by NOT believing in God.
[No you can't. I can't be called delusional if I refuse to believe in something that does not exist. That is the sign of a rational mind.]
You sure make a lot of sense. Can you prove God doesn't exist? Bring your evidence.I have evidence. I am the evidence.
[This is just stupid. You have no evidence whatsoever. You cannot claim god exists and use yourself as proof. That is a solipsism. You have to appeal to objectively verifiable data, which you cannot do. It is improper of you to ask me to prove the non-existence of god. Negative propositions cannot be proven. The burden of proof is upon you.]
Again, believe what you want. I don't care.
By the way, this is a politics forum, as someone said earlier, and this has gone on too long.
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We are open to liberty-lovers of all stripes. It doesn't matter what political party you registered or didn't register under, if you voted or didn't. You can be a Chicago-schoolite, a gun-toter, seasteader, dyed in the wool conservative, LPer, anarcho-capitalist or any of the endless varieties.
Yes, men throughout history have "wondered" about god, but so what? That means nothing. People have wondered about space aliens, too. Does that mean they exist? Wondering and believing do not add up to existence.
Finally, you have no rational basis for claiming this: "Humans exist because of God, not the other way around. The reason we can't comprehend God is because he is free of laws of physics. He CREATED the laws of physics."
This is irrational and false. That would mean the laws of physics are contingent realities, and that makes a mockery of the concept of natural law. God is not necessary to any understanding of the world.
How do you WHAT god created?! Your claim is a form of self-delusion that gives you comfort. You cannot back your argument up with anything other than more unsubstantiated and unsubstantiable assertions.
Finally, I don't HATE you. It is a common tactic of the believer to play the victim, and it's a form of intellectual surrender. I am not making fun of you. You are doing a fine job all by yourself.
To repeat: believe in what or whomever you want. Just don't confuse religion with politics or science.
Date: 2012-01-25, 3:38PM PST
People who don't believe in God can't tell us what happened before the big bang but they sure the hell know for 100% that God doesn't exist.
They should be agnostic not athiests. Its is SO OBVIOUS they have a hidden agenda (racism). Who cares about Darwin. A man hasn't existed or will ever exist on this planet, who hasn't wondered about God. Do we really think that Darwin didn't wonder about God. His short comings and low self esteem led him away from God.
Humans exist because of God, not the other way around. The reason we can't comprehend God is because he is free of laws of physics. He CREATED the laws of physics.
Please don't hate, dislike or make fun of people. Because you know you are doing it to youeself.
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re: re: re: two religions at war (universe)
Date: 2012-01-25, 9:05AM PST
Hey dude, how could you say that? I believe in God cuz it helps me as a person and it saved me it really seemed only possible cuz of god. I don't get atheists, what do they believe in fish was us? I am an ape cuz i am black so is that what you are saying? I evolved from apes cuz i am black
Btw THIS Is a political thing
Location: universe?
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God is not relevant to any scientific discussion because it is not analyzable or subject to empirical falsification. All attempts to prove "god's" existence collapse into solipsism and cognitive denial, because god is purely a function of man's imagination.
re: RE: religions at war (Planet Earth) (Universe)
Date: 2012-01-25, 3:14AM PST
God doesn't exist because we can't see God. This sure makes a lot of sense. I guess gravity, the strong nuclear forces and the weak nuclear forces don't exist either since we can't see them.
I remember in grade 11 our physics teacher told us that energy can not be created or destroyed. I hit him over the head and asked him, who created this energy?
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Muslims are often questioned, "Did not Muhammad call on all Muslims to kill the infidels?" The answer is absolutely not!
Then, we are asked another question: "Why then does the Quran say, "fight and slay the pagans (or infidels or unbelievers) wherever you find them?" (9:5).
There are two interrelated answers to that question. The first is historical. The second is related to the nature of the Quran itself.
HISTORY:
When the Islamic state was rapidly expanding in the seventh and eighth century, many people came under the direct governance of Muslims. These peoples belonged to different religions, races, ethnicities, etc. If the hypothesis that "Muslims are required to eradicate non-Muslims or "infidels" was correct, then a pattern of deliberate extermination, forced conversions, and/or expulsion would have been observed throughout the history of Islam, especially when Muslims were powerful and winning over their opponents.
That systematic pattern is simply absent. For example, let us take India. India (or considerable parts of it) was for several centuries under the Muslim Mughal Empire. Many of the subjects of the empire, up to and including very high-ranking state officials, were Hindu. (This does not mean that Hindus lived under no discrimination whatsoever. But this is another issue.) Till now, India is a predominantly Hindu country. The facts on the ground belie the hypothesis that Muslims have believed that non-Muslims should be killed, evicted, or forced to convert.
Another example: in contemporary Egypt, which was included in the Islamic state only ten years after the demise of the Prophet, about 6-10% of the people are Christians. Contrast this with Spain. For about eight centuries, Spain was a place of peaceful co-existence for Muslims, Christians, and Jews. (Again, I am not, at all, claiming that everyone enjoyed the same rights under the Arab/Muslim ruling.) However, in 1492 Ferdinand and Isabella signed the Edict of Expulsion designed to rid Spain of its Jews. The Jews were given a stark choice: baptism or deportation. An estimated 50,000 fled to the Ottoman empire where they were warmly welcomed. And about 70,000 converted to Christianity and remained in the country only to be plagued by the Inquisition which accused them of insincerity. In 1499, the Spanish state gave its Muslims the same choice: convert or leave. The result of these policies was simple: Spain almost entirely got rid of millions of people who were not Christians. (Spain now of course has minority groups, including Muslims coming mainly from North Africa as immigrants.)
The list goes on. Investigating history clearly shows that most (saying "all" cannot sustain historical scrutiny) Muslims have never believed that they are under obligation to exterminate non-Muslims, or as non-Muslims refer to such people as "Infidels". Of course, it would not be scholastic to say non-Muslims, at many times, enjoyed "full citizenship" (though this term is an anachronism in the context discussed here) but compared to other locations, minorities were significantly better off under Muslim ruling, when Muslims were in fact capable of inflicting severe harm on non-Muslims, especially if we were to acknowledge the absurd notion of Muslims ambition to "kill the infidels..."
I thought it was best to stop here for a few minutes to scrutinize this term "Infidel". We have heard, over and over again, the majority of commentators and "experts" on Islam using this term and attributing it to Islam's and Muslims sentimentality of non-Muslims.
I, as a Muslim, have never called a non-Muslim an "Infidel", so this word was actually foreign to my vocabulary, until I have heard it mentioned several time by Christian and Zionist so-called "experts" on Islam. As a matter of fact, I took the liberty of going through several widely used translations of the Quran to find this oft-spoken "infidel" term. The translations of the Quran of which I researched included: M. Khan, Yusuf Ali, Shakir, and Pickthal, only to find out that in all of these translations, I did not find this word "infidel" in any of them! The Arabic word "Kaafir, Kafir, Kufar" was translated as Disbelievers or Unbelievers.
What's more interesting, after digging deeper, we discovered this term was being used centuries before the advent of Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him). The term infidel comes from the Latin word infidelis, which means "unbelieving" or "unfaithful." During the Middle Ages ( A.D.c. 450--c. 1500), the Catholic Church (Christians) used the term to describe Muslims (followers of Islam, the religion founded by the prophet Muhammad; c. A.D.570--632).
Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary states the following on the term "infidel":
Main Entry: in·fi·del
Pronunciation: 'in-f&-d & l, -f&-"del
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English infidele, from Middle French, from Late Latin infidelis unbelieving, from Latin, unfaithful, from in- + fidelis faithful -- more at FIDELITY
1: one who is not a Christian or who opposes Christianity
2 a: an unbeliever with respect to a particular religion b : one who acknowledges no religious belief
3: a disbeliever in something specified or understood
- infidel adjective
Two remaining points:
(1) There is the claim that Muslims only refrained from killing the infidels because of the economic benefits of "enslaving" them. Most of those who claim this also claim that Muslims are inherently violent because of the "clear" Quranic injunctions against the "Infidels". This position is, at least, contradictory. Because on the one hand, Muslims' violence is rooted in the Quran, and, on the other hand, generations upon generations of Muslims simply discarded the Quran for their economic well-being. If Muslims persistently and universally prefer economic prosperity to the Quran and the commandments of the Prophet, then both the Quran and the Prophet are irrelevant to them. So why the attempt to ground Muslim behavior in the Quran and the Prophetic tradition if these are in fact not important at all to Muslims? If Muslims stick to the Quran, so why did not they exterminate the other, a policy allegedly supported unequivocally by the Quran? There is no way out of this fallacious reasoning except by saying that Muslims evoke whatever serves their interest. This statement of the entire Muslim nation being innately incoherent and immoral is espoused by many Islamophobes. This statement tells us much more about the Islamophobes themselves than about Muslims, however.
(2) In the modern era, some Muslim people participated in the genocide of non-Muslims, such as the Armenians by the Turks and the East Timorese by the Indonesians. However, these killings were undertaken by secular regimes for nationalistic reasons. I do not think anyone can claim, for instance, that Ataturk, the father of the secularized Turkey and the abolisher of the Islamic caliphate, oppressed the Armenians (and the Greeks), to rid Turkey of them, in the name of Islam.
(A relevant link to this discussion concerning the genocide in Rwanda and the attitude of Muslims.)
THE QURAN:
(1) The Quran is not classified subject-wise. Verses on various topics appear in dispersed places in the Quran and no order can be ascertained from the sequence of its text. The first verses revealed in the Quran was in chapter (surah) 96.
(2) The structure of the Quran makes it necessary to approach it using the dialectic "both and" methodology of reasoning. This means that to investigate a certain issue, the verses pertaining to the issue should be gathered together. The verses are then analyzed comprehensively while paying attention to the historical context (in Islamic terminology called the "occasion of revelation") of each verse. The truth is considered to be found in all the relevant verses, because if the Quran is divine as the vast majority of Muslims believe, it should be free from real contradictions and inconsistencies. Apparent contradictions are not only reconciled and transcended but are thoroughly investigated because they actually reflect deep meanings and paradigms. (This is akin, for example, to the process of understanding the Chinese idiom, "a man is stronger than iron and weaker than a fly." Although the wise saying is superficially self-contradictory, it reveals a deep fact about humans who, in some situations, are very strong. Yet, in other contexts, these same people are very weak.) If the reductionist approach to the Quran is valid, then all ideas, from violence to absolute pacifism, can be justified and rationalized using the Quran. For the Quran does not only contain verses about war, it is also replete with verses about forgiveness and countering evil with good.
(3) The same Quran that reads, "Whoever then acts aggressively against you, inflict injury on him according to the injury he has inflicted on you" (2:194), also reads, "Goodness and evil are not the same. So repel evil with goodness, then the one who had enmity between you becomes a trusted and dear friend" (41:34). When it comes to dealing with a transgressor, the Quran is basically delineating four different strategies, the validity of which is contingent on the situational and contextual factors. The first is retaliation which is permissible on the condition that it does not exceed the limits. Verse (2:194) is clear on this, "whoever then acts aggressively against you, inflict injury on him according to the injury he has inflicted on you." Verse (16:126) gives the same meaning, "and if you take your turn, then retaliate with the like of that with which you were afflicted." Verse (3:134) gives the other three strategies, "and those who restrain their anger and pardon men; and God loves the doers of good to others." The three methods given here are, (a) to restrain one's anger and not respond, (b) to pardon the wrongdoer, and (c) to do good to the transgressor. According to verse, method (c) is the most beloved by God. Here the Quran teaches the superiority, in the sight of God, of responding to evil with goodness. Now what should the Muslim do when wronged? It depends on the context, on the situational factors. Under some circumstances, the wrongdoer must be punished. Under others, one should refrain from retaliation, or go a step further to wholehearted forgiveness, or even repel the transgressor's evil with goodness. The above is important for explaining how to deal with the Quranic text.
(4) The Quranic principle for dealing with the 'other' non-Muslim is clear from verses (60:8-9), "God does not forbid you respecting those who have not made war against you on account of your religion, and have not driven you forth from your homes, that you show them kindness and deal with them justly; surely God loves the doers of justice. God only forbids you respecting and loving those who made war upon you on account of your religion, and drove you forth from your homes and backed up others in your expulsion, that you make friends with them, and whoever makes friends with them, these are the unjust." The Quran does not present Islam as a religion of unquestionable pacifism or relentless aggression. Those who do not transgress should be treated humanely and benevolently with complete respect. Those who transgress should be fought, "And fight in the cause of God those who fight against you, and do not commit aggression. Indeed God does not love those who are aggressors," (2:190). In other words, Islam is a religion of peace, not in the sense that it is pacifist, but in the sense that Muslims can and should co-exist peacefully with others who respect them. Neither transgression is permitted nor forcing others to espouse Islam as the Quran says, "there is no compulsion in religion," (2:256).
(5) Based on the above, we can now investigate verse (9:5), "But when the forbidden months are past, then fight and slay the Pagans wherever ye find them, an seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem (of war); but if they repent, and establish regular prayers and practise regular charity, then open the way for them: for Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful." One of the main concerns of Chapter (Surah) 9 of the Quran (a Surah is a collection of verses) was to delineate the strategies for dealing with the polytheists of the Arabian Peninsula after the Muslims, under the leadership of Prophet Muhammad, peacefully captured Mecca (In January, 630, Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him and his followeres were joined by tribe after tribe along their way to Mecca. They entered Mecca without bloodshed and the Meccans, seeing the tide had turned, joined them.) the city that since the beginning of Islam lead the oppression and persecution of the Muslim converts.
(6) Since the polytheists differed in their relationship with the new religion after its victory, there was a need to differentiate between the malevolent enemies of Islam bent on destroying the Muslims and who did not observe their treaties with the Muslims, those who hated Islam but were willing to honor their treaties with Muslims, those who rejected Islam but peacefully co-existed with the Muslim community, etc. The aforementioned verse (9:5) was concerned with the most vehement opponents of the Islamic faith not by virtue of their refusal to be Muslims but by continually breaching their treaties with the Muslims and fighting them. Given that, their treatment is not equal, the complete verse says, "So when the sacred months have passed away, then fight and slay the pagans wherever you find them, and take them captives and besiege them and keep them under observation, then if they repent and keep up prayer and pay the poor-rate, leave their way free to them; surely God is Forgiving, Merciful." Meaning: so when the grace period (4 months) is past, and if the other party insists on fighting Islam, then a state of war is inevitable. The struggle may take the form of killing, or capture and imprisonment, or just keeping an eye on these enemies to fend off their evil if they decide to launch an offensive against Muslims. The punishment should be fair and just and, thus, must be proportional to the crimes actually committed. Not only this, but the pagans can repent and accept Islam, as evident from the last part of (9:5), or desist from attacking Muslims and ask for protection, as evident from the next verse (9:6), "If one amongst the pagans ask you for asylum, grant it to him, so that he may hear the word of God; and then escort him to where he can be secure."
Understanding the verses' historical context is crucial, not to confine them to their context, but for a proper comprehension of their implications. Moreover, as shown previously, the verse must be interpreted along with all the other verses explicating how a Muslim should deal with others, Muslim or non-Muslim, including verse (8:61), "And if they incline to peace, then incline to it and trust in God; surely He is the Hearing, the Knowing."
The worst thing to do with the Quran is to approach it seeking confirmation for what one already believes in and turning a blind eye to any evidence that is inconsistent with his/her pre-conceived attitudes and biases. Anyone can find in the Quran whatever he/she wants to prove. Anyone can do the same thing with the Bible. The challenge, however, is to make a judgment only after a thorough and exhaustive investigation of all available Quranic evidence.
A Muslim may become selective and simply ignore some indispensable principles while working out what she or he should do in a given situation. Apart from self-indulgence, the socio-political context plays an important role in inducing this selectivity. A Muslim living where she or he finds Islam constantly reviled, the Prophet perpetually vituperated, and the Quran persistently misquoted may respond apologetically by declaring Islam as an "obviously" pacifist religion, ignoring anything in the Quran and the Prophetic traditions testifying to the contrary. A Muslim witnessing his wife being raped and his children slaughtered will very likely discard the well-established Islamic rules of engagement. The prevalent conditions are not a valid justification, but Muslims are humans after all, and humans -- all humans -- succumb to their overwhelming context. (Interestingly, the context was correctly and convincingly evoked in the U.S. media to understand the Abu Gharib prison abuses. When it comes to why some Muslims go to extremes, there is no context, only a culture of evil and fanaticism.)
Other interesting articles: Analysis of Chapter 9: 1-28
Location: vancouver
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The proselytizing zeal of Christians is the greatest threat to our liberties and freedom of thought. If it weren't for these wacko, superstitious Christians, the Muslim world would not be in the mess it's in.
Location: vancouver
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Dear Friends of the Russia & America GoodWill Association (RAGA)! The RAGA stays away from politics, except when peace is threatened.
Below is my translation of a report about Russian troops being put on high alert, as it appeared on Russia's polit.ru site.
The Kremlin is being updated about the upcoming US-backed Israeli attack on Iranian nuclear facilities, according to "Nezavisimaya Gazeta", citing sources in the Defense Ministry. Strike will be sudden and inflicted very soon.
A full-scale war is possible. This issue was discussed at the Russia-EU summit in Brussels with the participation of Russian President Dmitry Medvedev. Russia's permanent representative to the EU Vladimir Chizhov stated that the Israeli / the U.S attack on Iran. would lead to "catastrophic development of events."
According to the newspaper, the military preparations of Russia to minimize the loss resulting from such a military action against Tehran were launched a year ago and are now almost complete. According to sources in the Defense Ministry, Russian 102nd military base in Armenia was fully optimized during October-November 2011.
Military families were evacuated to Russia; Russian garrison stationed near Yerevan was reduced in size; military units stationed there were transferred to the district of Gyumri, close to the Turkish border. U.S. strikes on the targets in Iran are expected from Turkey's territory.. Since December 1, 2011 Russian forces at military bases in South Ossetia and Abkhazia' have been put on high alert combat readiness; and Black Sea Fleet ships now cruise near the border with Georgia, which in this conflict may take the side of anti-Iranian forces.
Hans Blix
Today, Hans Blix, former Head of International Atomic Energy Agency (1981 -- 1997), told RT from Stockholm, Sweden, that:
"Threats by hawks in Israel and the US will not succeed in scaring the Iranians."
Former Chief of the UN Inspections Commission on WMD in Iraq (2000 -- 2003), Blix sees ominous similarities with the fake search for weapons of mass destruction in Iraq.
Yesterday Sergei Ryabov, Russia's Deputy Foreign Minister, warned against US constantly increasing pressure on Iran; Russia favors a diplomatic solution, as we are trying to convince our Israeli friends of the enormous risks Israel would be taking, said Ryabov.
The Israeli public is far from being united behind the Right-Wing's plans for a "pre-emptive" attack.
In addition to Ephraim Halevy, former Mossad chief, Israeli Minister of Finance Yuval Steinitz, Strategic Affairs Minister Moshe Ya'alon, Interior Minister Eli Yishai, Intelligence and Atomic Energy Minister Dan Meridor and Minister-without-Portfolio Benny Begin remain firmly opposed to any action against Iran.
Why don't we know this from US mass media?
Read: "How Zionism infiltrated the US" with Mark Bruzonsky, a Jewish-American activist who has been a key member behind the Israeli Palestinian peace initiative in the 1980s.
In essence, he confirms the thesis of The Israel Lobby and U.S. Foreign Policy, a 2007 book published by two leading US scholars, Steve Walt and John Mearsheimer.
According to Bruzonsky, The US has prevented a settlement of the Arab-Israeli conflict because the Israelis set up such powerful institutions, lobbies, publications, personalities, and their control of political parties and of the media make it impossible for American leaders to do what they knew they should do to solve this cancer.
Read more in How Zionism infiltrated the U.S.
The questions about ill-informed Americans remain: Why the Arab Spring protesters were hailed as heroes whereas our own OWS activists are condemned as villains?
Am I mistaken that-- in order to obtain a better information about the USA- one has to go to foreign sources, BBC, Aljazeera and, yes, RT? Malice Toward None. Good Will to All. Peace to the World. And--Peaceful Christmas!
From RAGA site:
"We are an association of Americans who believe it is in the U.S. national interests to foster friendship with Russia on the basis of mutual Good Will and non-interference in each other's affairs. RAGA is a gathering of people who share common interests in Russia's history, culture, religion, economy, politics and the way of life.
We feel that Russian people have made outstanding contributions to humankind and are capable of greater achievements. We envision Russia as a strong, independent, proud and free nation and as a partner in achieving peace in the world."
Feedback is always welcome. Please share with us your ideas on peace.
Sincerely, W George Krasnow (Vladislav Krasnov) President, RAGA www.raga.org Facebook
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It should be a personal thing anyway. Organized religions tend to get co-opted by
extremists and used as an excuse for all sorts of abberant behavior. Evangelism is
just a way of imposing your ideas on someone else.
If you remove religion from the mix we could relate better to each other as indiduals
and come to the realization that most of us want the same thing. To live our lives in
peace as much as possible.
It's certainly worth discussing, anyway, rather than getting stuck on endless rants
about who is more righteous.
Location: Everywhere
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Free speech comes with responsibilities to be be honest, a trait that this Christian cannot understand. THAT'S why it deserves to be flagged.
"anti-muslim bigot" ha (back at you)
Date: 2012-01-24, 1:14AM PST
oh stop, this is garbage you are spewing and I think you know that. I don't to rush out and watch some youtube ideology. That little rant about the jews, obviously bigotry on your part. If a christian is joked about like they do so boldly on family guy and other smut, we laugh. But the minute a danish cartoonist cracks a joke muslims go up in smoke like you did you bigot.
I have read about the blood curds, etc. Roman catholicism. But they apologized and moved on. Muslims seem to see this as the scourge of their times.
www.ctalkcanada.com and www.bluenation.com are good blogs about fair and balanced idealogues that are expressed.
Oh no flagging, oh no, my opinion and I have a right to it, something we canadians are allowed, free speech and opinion. Just like you are allowed to spew your garbage, you obviously vote for the new democrats and their leftist opinion on ensuring right opinions should be dismantled and burned.
This is seriously a terrible thing to discuss or even whisper about. Show some humility, a real christian version. Read about sharia law. Read ethical oil you left winged loon, you are a loon and you know it.
FREE SPEECH AND RIGHT TO FREE OPINIONS ARE ALLOWED LOOK IT UP ON THE "CANADIAN CONSTITUTION" AND "CHARTER OF RIGHTS AND FREEDOMS".
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The anti-Muslim bigot speaks -
Date: 2012-01-23, 9:01PM PST
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
At least Muslims don't subvert out governments and corrupt our newspapers.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
You just accused yourself of the same thing you accused the anti-Muslim biggot of. Not all Jews subvert governments and corrupt our newspapers
Location: vancovuer B.C.
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The best solution is to vote but refuse to buy into the game. Find people who are mad enough, but smart enough, to run as independents or to form a new party, and vote for them. Alternatively, vote strategically for the candidate that has the best chance of unseating the corrupt Harperites or B.C. Gliberals.
The sad fact is that popular democracy has run its course and we need a new governing model.
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I suppose when you vote and if you vote, you should try to figure out which party will do
least amount of damage. The Green Party seems to fill this bill right now. Not much
chance of them getting elected, but maybe to get emough MPS and Mla'S to be a thorn
in the side of the meglomaniacs and idiots who currently run things here. We do need
canaries in the shitholes of canadian parliaments.
All we can do is try trip up the powers that be by outthinking them. Don't buy their crap.
drive a fuel efficient car and walk everywhere you can. turn off the television and read a
good book and not on a g.d. i-pad. recycle as much as you can. leave blogs against what
goes on right now everywhere you can. The governments will not cut down on our carbon
footprint because their beholden to the oil companies who finance their elections. Let's do
what we can do ourselves. Each and every drop helps fill a bucket.
Location: canada
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Martin gave this speech in 1954, though its as if it was given yestereday...it explains what is needed to fix the system;
Reverend Simmons, platform associates, members and friends of Second Baptist Church, I need not pause to say how happy I am to be here this morning, and to be a part of this worship service. It is certainly with a deal of humility that I stand in this pulpit so rich in tradition and history. Second Baptist Church, as you know, has the reputation of being one of the great churches of our nation, and it is certainly a challenge that, for me to stand here this morning, to be in the pulpit of Reverend Banks and of a people who are so great and rich in tradition.
I'm not exactly a stranger in the city of Detroit, for I have been here several times before. And I remember back in about 1944 or 1945, somewhere back in there, that I came to Second Baptist Church for the first time--I think that was the year that the National Baptist Convention met here. And of course I have a lot of relatives in this city, so that Detroit is really something of a second home for me, and I don't feel too much a stranger here this morning. So it is indeed a pleasure and a privilege for me to be in this city this morning, and to be here to worship with you in the absence of your very fine and noble pastor, Dr. Banks.
I want you to think with me this morning from the subject: "Rediscovering Lost Values." "Rediscovering Lost Values." There is something wrong with our world, something fundamentally and basically wrong. I don't think we have to look too far to see that. I'm sure that most of you would agree with me in making that assertion. And when we stop to analyze the cause of our world's ills, many things come to mind.
We begin to wonder if it is due to the fact that we don't know enough. But it can't be that. Because in terms of accumulated knowledge we know more today than men have known in any period of human history. We have the facts at our disposal. We know more about mathematics, about science, about social science, and philosophy than we've ever known in any period of the world's history. So it can't be because we don't know enough.
And then we wonder if it is due to the fact that our scientific genius lags behind. That is, if we have not made enough progress scientifically. Well then, it can't be that. For our scientific progress over the past years has been amazing. Man through his scientific genius has been able to dwarf distance and place time in chains, so that today it's possible to eat breakfast in New York City and supper in London, England. Back in about 1753 it took a letter three days to go from New York City to Washington, and today you can go from here to China in less time than that. It can't be because man is stagnant in his scientific progress. Man's scientific genius has been amazing.
I think we have to look much deeper than that if we are to find the real cause of man's problems and the real cause of the world's ills today. If we are to really find it I think we will have to look in the hearts and souls of men. (Lord help him)
The trouble isn't so much that we don't know enough, but it's as if we aren't good enough. The trouble isn't so much that our scientific genius lags behind, but our moral genius lags behind. (Well) The great problem facing modern man is that, that the means by which we live (Help him God) have outdistanced the spiritual ends for which we live. (That's right) So we find ourselves caught in a messed-up world. (Well) The problem is with man himself and man's soul. We haven't learned how to be just and honest and kind and true and loving. And that is the basis of our problem. The real problem is that through our scientific genius we've made of the world a neighborhood, but through our moral and spiritual genius we've failed to make of it a brotherhood. (Lord have mercy) And the great danger facing us today is not so much the atomic bomb that was created by physical science. Not so much that atomic bomb that you can put in an aeroplane and drop on the heads of hundreds and thousands of people--as dangerous as that is. But the real danger confronting civilization today is that atomic bomb which lies in the hearts and souls of men, (Lord have mercy) capable of exploding into the vilest of hate and into the most damaging selfishness--that's the atomic bomb that we've got to fear today. (Lord help him) Problem is with the men. (Yes, yes) Within the heart and the souls of men. (Lord) That is the real basis of our problem. (Well)
My friends, all I'm trying to say is that if we are to go forward today, we've got to go back and rediscover some mighty precious values that we've left behind. (Yes) That's the only way that we would be able to make of our world a better world, and to make of this world what God wants it to be and the real purpose and meaning of it. The only way we can do it is to go back (Yes) and rediscover some mighty precious values that we've left behind.
Our situation in the world today reminds me of a very popular situation that took place in the life of Jesus. It was read in the Scripture for the morning, found over in the second chapter of Luke's gospel. The story is very familiar, very popular; we all know it. You remember when Jesus was about twelve years old, (Well) there was the custom of the feast. Jesus' parents took him up to Jerusalem. That was an annual occasion, the feast of the Passover, and they went up to Jerusalem and they took Jesus along with them. And they were there a few days, and then after being there they decided to go back home, to Nazareth. (Lord help him) And they started out, and I guess as it was in the tradition in those days, the father probably traveled in front, and then the mother and the children behind. You see, they didn't have the modern conveniences that we have today. They didn't have automobiles and subways and buses. They walked, and traveled on donkeys and camels and what have you. So they traveled very slow, but it was usually the tradition for the father to lead the way. (Yeah)
And they left Jerusalem going on back to Nazareth, and I imagine they walked a little while and they didn't look back to see if everybody was there. But then the Scripture says, they went about a day's journey and they stopped, I imagine to check up, to see if everything was all right, and they discovered that something mighty precious was missing. They discovered that Jesus wasn't with them. (Yes) Jesus wasn't in the midst. (Come on) And so they paused there and looked and they didn't see him around. And they went on and started looking among the kinsfolk. And they went on back to Jerusalem and found him there, in the temple with the doctors of the law. (Yeah, That's right)
Now, the real thing that is to be seen here is this: that the parents of Jesus realized that they had left, and that they had lost a mighty precious value. They had sense enough to know that before they could go forward to Nazareth, they had to go backward to Jerusalem to rediscover this value. (That's right) They knew that. They knew that they couldn't go home to Nazareth until they went back to Jerusalem. (Come on)
Sometimes, you know, it's necessary to go backward in order to go forward. (Yes) That's an analogy of life. I remember the other day I was driving out of New York City into Boston, and I stopped off in Bridgeport, Connecticut, to visit some friends. And I went out of New York on a highway that's known as the Merritt Parkway, it leads into Boston, a very fine parkway. And I stopped in Bridgeport, and after being there for two or three hours I decided to go on to Boston, and I wanted to get back on the Merritt Parkway. And I went out thinking that I was going toward the Merritt Parkway. I started out, and I rode, and I kept riding, and I looked up and I saw a sign saying two miles to a little town that I knew I was to bypass--I wasn't to pass through that particular town. So I thought I was on the wrong road. I stopped and I asked a gentleman on the road which way would I get to the Merritt Parkway. And he said, "The Merritt Parkway is about twelve or fifteen miles back that way. You've got to turn around and go back to the Merritt Parkway; you are out of the way now." In other words, before I could go forward to Boston, I had to go back about twelve or fifteen miles to get to the Merritt Parkway. May it not be that modern man has gotten on the wrong parkway? (Lord help him) And if he is to go forward to the city of salvation, he's got to go back and get on the right parkway. (Amen)
And so that was the thing that Jesus' parents realized, that they had to go back and find this mighty precious value that they had left behind, in order to go forward. They realized that. And so they went back to Jerusalem and discovered Jesus, rediscovered him so to speak, in order to go forward to Nazareth. (Lord help him)
Now that's what we've got to do in our world today. We've left a lot of precious values behind; we've lost a lot of precious values. And if we are to go forward, if we are to make this a better world in which to live, we've got to go back. We've got to rediscover these precious values that we've left behind.
I want to deal with one or two of these mighty precious values that we've left behind, that if we're to go forward and to make this a better world, we must rediscover.
The first is this--the first principle of value that we need to rediscover is this: that all reality hinges on moral foundations. In other words, that this is a moral universe, and that there are moral laws of the universe just as abiding as the physical laws. (Lord help us) I'm not so sure we all believe that. We never doubt that there are physical laws of the universe that we must obey. We never doubt that. And so we just don't jump out of airplanes or jump off of high buildings for the fun of it--we don't do that. Because we unconsciously know that there is a final law of gravitation, and if you disobey it you'll suffer the consequences--we know that. Even if we don't know it in its Newtonian formulation, we know it intuitively, and so we just don't jump off the highest building in Detroit for the fun of it--we don't do that. Because we know that there is a law of gravitation which is final in the universe. (Lord) If we disobey it we'll suffer the consequences.
But I'm not so sure if we know that there are moral laws just as abiding as the physical law. I'm not so sure about that. I'm not so sure if we really believe that there is a law of love in this universe, and that if you disobey it you'll suffer the consequences. (Yes) I'm not so sure if we really believe that. Now at least two things convince me that we don't believe that, that we have strayed away from the principle that this is a moral universe. (Lord help him)
The first thing is that we have adopted in the modern world a sort of a relativistic ethic. Now I'm not trying to use a big word here; I'm trying to say something very concrete. And that is that we have accepted the attitude that right and wrong are merely relative to our . . . [recording interrupted]
Most people can't stand up for their convictions, because the majority of people might not be doing it. (Amen, Yes) See, everybody's not doing it, so it must be wrong. And since everybody is doing it, it must be right. (Yes, Lord help him) So a sort of numerical interpretation of what's right.
But I'm here to say to you this morning that some things are right and some things are wrong. (Yes) Eternally so, absolutely so. It's wrong to hate. (Yes, That's right) It always has been wrong and it always will be wrong. (Amen) It's wrong in America, it's wrong in Germany, it's wrong in Russia, it's wrong in China. (Lord help him) It was wrong in 2000 B.C., and it's wrong in 1954 A.D. It always has been wrong, (That's right) and it always will be wrong. (That's right) It's wrong to throw our lives away in riotous living. (Yeah) No matter if everybody in Detroit is doing it, it's wrong. (Yes) It always will be wrong, and it always has been wrong. It's wrong in every age and it's wrong in every nation. Some things are right and some things are wrong, no matter if everybody is doing the contrary. Some things in this universe are absolute. The God of the universe has made it so. And so long as we adopt this relative attitude toward right and wrong, we're revolting against the very laws of God himself. (Amen)
Now that isn't the only thing that convinces me that we've strayed away from this attitude, (Go ahead) this principle. The other thing is that we have adopted a sort of a pragmatic test for right and wrong--whatever works is right. (Yes) If it works, it's all right. Nothing is wrong but that which does not work. If you don't get caught, it's right. [laughter] That's the attitude, isn't it? It's all right to disobey the Ten Commandments, but just don't disobey the eleventh, "Thou shall not get caught." [laughter] That's the attitude. That's the prevailing attitude in our culture. (Come on) No matter what you do, just do it with a bit of finesse. (All right) You know, a sort of attitude of the survival of the slickest. Not the Darwinian survival of the fittest, but the survival of the slickest--whoever can be the slickest is the one who right. It's all right to lie, but lie with dignity. [laughter] It's all right to steal and to rob and extort, but do it with a bit of finesse. (Yes) It's even all right to hate, but just dress your hate up in the garments of love and make it appear that you are loving when you are actually hating. Just get by! That's the thing that's right according to this new ethic. (Lord help him)
My friends, that attitude is destroying the soul of our culture. (You're right there) It's destroying our nation. (Oh yes) The thing that we need in the world today is a group of men and women who will stand up for right and to be opposed to wrong, wherever it is. (Lord have mercy) A group of people who have come to see that some things are wrong, whether they're never caught up with. And some things are right, whether nobody sees you doing them or not.
All I'm trying to say to you is (Have mercy, my God) that our world hinges on moral foundations. God has made it so. God has made the universe to be based on a moral law. (Lord help him) So long as man disobeys it he is revolting against God. That's what we need in the world today: people who will stand for right and goodness. It's not enough to know the intricacies of zoology and biology, but we must know the intricacies of law. (Well) It is not enough to know that two and two makes four, but we've got to know somehow that it's right to be honest and just with our brothers. (Yes) It's not enough to know all about our philosophical and mathematical disciplines, (Have mercy) but we've got to know the simple disciplines of being honest and loving and just with all humanity. (Oh yes) If we don't learn it, we will destroy ourselves (That's right) by the misuse of our own powers. (Amen)
This universe hinges on moral foundations. (Yeah) There is something in this universe that justifies Carlyle in saying, "No lie can live forever." There is something in this universe that justifies William Cullen Bryant in saying, "Truth, crushed to earth, will rise again." (My Lord, Amen) There is something in this universe that justifies James Russell Lowell in saying,
Truth forever on the scaffold,
Wrong forever on the throne.
Yet that scaffold sways the future. (Lord help him)
Behind the dim unknown stands God,
Within the shadow keeping watch above his own. (Amen)
There is something in this universe that justifies the biblical writer in saying, "You shall reap what you sow." (Amen) This is a law-abiding universe. (Amen) This is a moral universe. It hinges on moral foundations. (Lord help him) If we are to make of this a better world, we've got to go back and rediscover that precious value that we've left behind. (Yes)
And then there is a second thing, a second principle that we've got to go back and rediscover. (Help him) And that is that all reality has spiritual control. In other words, we've got to go back and rediscover the principle that there is a God behind the process. Well this you say, "Why is it that you raise that as a point in your sermon, in a church? The mere fact we are at church, we believe in God, we don't need to go back and rediscover that. The mere fact that we are here, and the mere fact that we sing and pray, and come to church--we believe in God." Well, there's some truth in that. But we must remember that it's possible to affirm the existence of God with your lips and deny his existence with your life. (Amen, Preach) The most dangerous type of atheism is not theoretical atheism, but practical atheism (Amen)--that's the most dangerous type. (Lord have mercy) And the world, even the church, is filled up with people who pay lip service to God and not life service. (That's right, Filled up with, Come on, Lord help him) And there is always a danger that we will make it appear externally that we believe in God when internally we don't. (Yes) We say with our mouths that we believe in him, but we live with our lives like he never existed. (That's right) That is the ever-present danger confronting religion. That's a dangerous type of atheism.
And I think, my friends, that that is the thing that has happened in America. That we have unconsciously left God behind. Now, we haven't consciously done it; we have unconsciously done it. You see, the text, you remember the text said that Jesus' parents went a whole day's journey not knowing that he wasn't with them. They didn't consciously leave him behind. (Well) It was unconscious; went a whole day and didn't even know it. It wasn't a conscious process. You see, we didn't grow up and say, "Now, goodbye God, we're going to leave you now." The materialism in America has been an unconscious thing. Since the rise of the Industrial Revolution in England, and then the invention of all of our gadgets and contrivances and all of the things and modern conveniences--we unconsciously left God behind. We didn't mean to do it.
We just became so involved in getting our big bank accounts that we unconsciously forgot about God--we didn't mean to do it.
We became so involved in getting our nice luxurious cars, and they're very nice, but we became so involved in it that it became much more convenient to ride out to the beach on Sunday afternoon than to come to church that morning. (Yes) It was an unconscious thing--we didn't mean to do it.
We became so involved and fascinated by the intricacies of television that we found it a little more convenient to stay at home than to come to church. It was an unconscious thing--we didn't mean to do it. We didn't just go up and say, "Now God, we're gone." (Lord help him) We had gone a whole day's journey (Yes) and then we came to see that we had unconsciously ushered God out of the universe. A whole day's journey--didn't mean to do it. We just became so involved in things that we forgot about God. (Oh yes)
And that is the danger confronting us, my friends: that in a nation as ours where we stress mass production, and that's mighty important, where we have so many conveniences and luxuries and all of that, there is the danger that we will unconsciously forget about God. I'm not saying that these things aren't important; we need them, we need cars, we need money; all of that's important to live. But whenever they become substitutes for God, (Yes) they become injurious. (Amen)
And may I say to you this morning, (Lord help him) that none of these things can ever be real substitutes for God. Automobiles and subways, televisions and radios, dollars and cents can never be substitutes for God. (Amen) For long before any of these came into existence, we needed God. (Amen, Yes) And long after they will have passed away, we will still need God. (Oh yeah)
And I say to you this morning in conclusion (Lord have mercy) that I'm not going to put my ultimate faith in things. I'm not going to put my ultimate faith in gadgets and contrivances. As a young man with most of my life ahead of me, I decided early (Oh yeah) to give my life to something eternal and absolute. (All right) Not to these little gods that are here today and gone tomorrow, (Come on) but to God who is the same yesterday, today, and forever. (Amen, Amen)
Not in the little gods that can be with us in a few moments of prosperity, (Yes) but in the God who walks with us through the valley of the shadow of death, (That's right) and causes us to fear no evil. (All right) That's the God. (Come on)
Not in the god that can give us a few Cadillac cars and Buick convertibles, as nice as they are, that are in style today and out of style three years from now, (All right) but the God who threw up the stars (Come on) to bedeck the heavens like swinging lanterns of eternity. (All right, Oh yes)
Not in the god that can throw up a few skyscraping buildings, but the God who threw up the gigantic mountains, kissing the sky, (Amen) as if to bathe their peaks in the lofty blues. (Yes)
Not in the god that can give us a few televisions and radios, but the God who threw up that great cosmic light that gets up early in the morning in the eastern horizon, (Oh yes) who paints its technicolor across the blue (Oh yes, Come on)--something that man could never make. (All right, Yes)
I'm not going to put my ultimate faith in the little gods that can be destroyed in an atomic age, (Yes) but the God who has been our help in ages past, (Come on) and our hope for years to come, (All right) and our shelter in the time of storm, (Oh yes) and our eternal home. That's the God that I'm putting my ultimate faith in. (Oh yes, Come on now) That's the God that I call upon you to worship this morning. (Yes)
Go out and be assured that that God is going to last forever. (Yes) Storms might come and go. (Yes) Our great skyscraping buildings will come and go. (Yes) Our beautiful automobiles will come and go, but God will be here. (Amen) Plants may wither, the flowers may fade away, but the word of our God shall stand forever and nothing can ever stop him. (Bring it down) All of the P-38s in the world can never reach God. All of our atomic bombs can never reach him. The God that I'm talking about this morning (Come on) is the God of the universe and the God that will last through the ages. (All right) If we are to go forward this morning, (Well) we've got to go back and find that God. (All right) That is the God that demands and commands our ultimate allegiance. (Right)
If we are to go forward, (Oh yes) we must go back and rediscover these precious values: (Well) that all reality hinges on moral foundations (Lord have mercy) and that all reality has spiritual control. (Yes) God bless you. (Amen, Amen, Amen)
Location: Rediscovering lost values
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What we lack is the vision and will to go on our own. We could write self
sufficiency into our Constitution. It is criminal that we do not do the
value added part of the sale of our natural resourses.
The old World Order is Dying. The USA is a badly wounded, dangerous
animal in it"s death throes. If we keep going and tying ourselves to losers
we will just be as bad off as they are. The old system is in shambles. The
goodness has been drained out of if by the people for whom enough is
never enough.
What it will take is some altruist people who are not governed by self interest
and have a modcum of intelligence. We need a national spine to get where we
need to go. If we have the balls to work it out we could have a great country
here. We don't need to follow the rest of the world as it spirals down the drain.
And no cute, euphemistic way of looking at this can change the reality that this
is possible,
What do we get out of the sale of our raw logs. Pressboard shit furniture from
China. Give me a break! This is horseshit if there ever was.
We can't compete with Asian peasant wages. Why should we. They can take
care of their own. Build our own furniture with our own wood, and get the
jobs and better quality furniture to boot.
Lets get started. There is nothing to lose.
Location: all of Canada
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Your plan won't work because the price of oil in set by international markets. One price, One planet! Venezuela tried what you proposed and the oil companies fled the country afterwords. With all the reserves they have, Venezuelans are running out of gasoline. http://www.laht.com/article.asp?CategoryId=10717&ArticleId=334115
The price of gasoline is more related to all the taxes we pay per liter. Just look at the price of gasoline between Calgary and Vancouver.
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Surrey Main Library rm 306 Floor 3, Jan 14 saturday 2pm-3pm. Attend talk over what corporate mainstream media routinely miss in reporting news.
Put context to corporate & government policy and actions.
See deliberate consequences of sanctions and preemptive military-intervention foreign policy.
Location: Surrey Main Library
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"The answer to the original question 'Work within the system when you can, cook the books when you can, never rip off the average Joe and never give up'"
Just noting that the person who made the above post as an answer to "the original question" put the answer in quotes making it appear as though it was already stated when in fact that exact answer, nor any insinuations similar to that answer, appears nowhere in any of the responses. Putting statements in quotations when they were never stated is misleading and should always be pointed out during any type of discourse.
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Too stupid to figure out that if you purchase the books from the billionaires before you get the "secrets" they are no longer a give away, And you're stupid enough to believe their "secrets" are worth something. Just shut up and crawl back into your hole you dumb loser.
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You're the one who should get off CL because you're too unintelligent. . . a soft way of saying you're stupid.
You say these billionaires are giving away "secrets" but you're too stupid to figure out that you have to purchase the books first from these billionaires before you get the "secrets". Thus they are not giving them away.
Are you're also too stupid to figure out that people who purchase these books are not getting any secrets at all and if your stupid enough to believe that there's another good reason why you're too stupid to be commenting on CL.
And you're also too stupid to figure out that many commentators reply with a quote. . .. An optional function that you will find on almost every discussion board on the Internet.
So please stop being so dumb and grow up and stop posting with such ignorance and stupidity.
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"...books from Gates, Trump And A guy called Warren pretty successful I would say giving away a few secrets"
They gave away the secrets after people purchased the books.... so the secrets weren't really "given away" now, were they?
Why don't you just copy and paste the title of those books so the person inquiring can purchase them, learn the "few secrets" for himself and become a billionaire too.
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People have become used to rapidly rising property values and stock market profits that
are based on no real work performed. They have no substance and if you stop to take a
breath, this phony system will pass you buy in the time it takes to scratch your ass.
Buying stuff you don't really need to boost your self esteem is just sadly wrong footed.
Does it really make you happy or just tie you to another debt. If you are keeping up with
the Joneses, your keeping up with idiots.
The only real way to get out of this is to get real. Repeat-Something for nothing does
not exsist! Pay down your debt if at all possible. Bankruptcy exposes you as a dupe of
the system and means that your own stupidity is causing financial hurt to others.
Demand quality in the goods you buy and don't buy then till you get it it. The crap
that they produce these days is a disgrace and then you borrow to buy it and pay for
the junk twice.
Learn what compound interest is. The credit cards charge unreal interest rates if you
pay them off at the mimimun payment. Instead, buy your clothes, cooking utensils,
and clothes at 25 cents or less on the dollar at Value Village and the Sally Anns.
Stick you middle finger up when you pass the junk stores like Walmart and Target.
Save religousley to buy your big ticket items with cash. And is that piece of shit
house you are selling really worth 1/2 a million bucks.
All we really need to do is get real. This is a time when lowered expectations are in
order. Pay off your debts and you'll feel a great weight removed from your shoulders.
David Rockefeller can't touch you if you don't frequent his banks.
No slight of hand like a world currency (which would be a larger Euro situation) will fix
the current malaise. We will have to do it ourselves. GET IT!
Location: the world at large
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They are a paid subscription service. Peddling their new age wares perhaps?
Why didn't they get a celebrity to break the news and not some guy (James Martinez) I've never heard of who has a terribly designed website? Just saying.
Lastly if you really wanted to get buy in from the public you would rely on the masters of media manipulation ie FOX, CNN, MSNBC, etc.
Location: Hogwash?
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I checked into starting my own small business last year and found that there
was just no way to make a profit at doing it. This could be a type of protectionism
of the status quo.
This is not the only province in Canada. The powers that be want to flush all the
low level players out of here anyway, so it can become their playground. There's
no point in not toeing the line on taxes and licenses. They will make sure you pay
double when the catch you.
Just don't see much light at the end of the tunnel.
Location: All of B.C.
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